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[10:44:29] <travis-ci> pypa/pipfile#4 (master - d025a8e : Pradyun Gedam): The build is still failing.

[10:44:29] <travis-ci> Change view : https://github.com/pypa/pipfile/compare/7d7c3126dcfc...d025a8ef4a02

[10:44:29] <travis-ci> Build details : https://travis-ci.com/pypa/pipfile/builds/165973205

[11:26:33] <travis-ci> pypa/pip#16150 (master - 1dbcd12 : Pradyun Gedam): The build passed.

[11:26:33] <travis-ci> Change view : https://github.com/pypa/pip/compare/d911a9fcb8d2...1dbcd1223658

[11:26:33] <travis-ci> Build details : https://travis-ci.org/pypa/pip/builds/686954496

[11:43:48] <pradyunsg> And that’s a question that we’ve been hitting a lot over the past few weeks, and is something that I’d like us (as a broader group) figure out the answer.

[11:44:03] <pradyunsg> I don’t even know if we want the final answer to be a compromise (read: everyone will be slightly unhappy) or a clearly opinionated choice (read: clear lines for what is "something else’s job").

[22:12:54] <sumanah> techalchemy: how you holding up?

[22:13:07] <techalchemy> sumanah, very poorly

[22:13:24] <sumanah> techalchemy: you wanna talk about it? I'm here (public, pm, videocall)

[22:14:07] <techalchemy> that was yet another week of azure-related failures it looks like, first because azure was doing things wrong before, and now because even though azure is still failing for no reason but github CI which i just added is now passing...

[22:15:16] <sumanah> techalchemy: ok

[22:15:17] <techalchemy> I just want to solve the actual problem I am setting out to address :|

[22:15:20] <sumanah> techalchemy: right

[22:15:37] <sumanah> techalchemy: it's been suggested that you cut another prerelease/beta, which, to me, sounds like a reasonable thing to do

[22:16:19] <sumanah> unless you would prefer to avoid "here's a beta I made despite CI flakiness"

[22:16:25] <techalchemy> yeah i can do that, depending on the rest of the night, i can attempt to do it today

[22:17:21] <techalchemy> there's one CI issue left but it's not one I am going to address, it's not really something the relevant library should support

[22:17:30] <sumanah> techalchemy: also: maybe I misunderstood something, but, it seemed like on Friday/Saturday you were ready to make a release. did something regress?

[22:17:36] <techalchemy> yes

[22:19:36] <techalchemy> I was merging what should have been a simple fix in vistir to address #4195 but CI failed across the board for all kinds of strange reasons, but if cross platform / compatibility suport is broken in vistir it means it would be broken in pipenv (a consumer of vistir)

[22:20:54] <techalchemy> fairly sure at this point half of the issues were my fault for making some wrong assumptions which were exposed by a change in how azure is spinning up windows environments, while the other half is due to a change in the filesystem encoding on osx -- maybe?

[22:21:17] <sumanah> techalchemy: could you revert that change, and then release what was master at that moment?

[22:21:34] <techalchemy> i could rever it but that isn't what broke things

[22:21:44] <techalchemy> which is the bigger issue

[22:22:05] <sumanah> is there an artifact, which existed on Saturday morning, which you could release?

[22:23:07] <techalchemy> no? I was making this change as part of what should have been some quick revendoring in preparation to release

[22:23:38] <sumanah> ah

[22:23:54] <sumanah> ok, thanks, techalchemy, I had not understood

[22:24:13] <sumanah> do you need help making an update comment on the release tracking issue so people understand what they can expect next?

[22:25:06] <techalchemy> that'd be a massive help if you are up for it, i've been focused on trying to get everything together since I was already behind

[22:25:19] <techalchemy> but am acutely aware that some communication is necessary

[22:25:26] <sumanah> right

[22:25:47] <sumanah> ok, techalchemy start up a collaborative document on Hackmd or Dropbox Paper or whatever you like and I'll make a quick outline/draft

[22:37:59] <techalchemy> sumanah, https://etherpad.wikimedia.org/p/pipenvupdate sorry forgot to paste it

[22:53:35] <sumanah> techalchemy: ok - so - my suggestion is that we work on this on the assumption that it will be a GitHub issue update, and then mention it in a quick note to the mailing lists

[22:54:33] <techalchemy> makes sense to me

[23:00:23] <sumanah> ok techalchemy here's a draft

[23:00:29] <sumanah> thanks for all the info so I could rearrange it

[23:06:12] <techalchemy> thanks for all the help rearranging and wording sumanah

[23:06:51] <travis-ci> pypa/pip#16169 (master - a879bc4 : Pradyun Gedam): The build passed.

[23:06:52] <travis-ci> Change view : https://github.com/pypa/pip/compare/9f0665cefe1ce116ee9335d6d494f1f07023d3a8...a879bc448ae8555cb3e7c22457394e3647a0ee64

[23:06:52] <travis-ci> Build details : https://travis-ci.org/pypa/pip/builds/687221570

[23:07:33] <sumanah> :)

[23:08:36] <techalchemy> sumanah, seriously I know it seems like that should have been easy but typing sentences is hard

[23:09:36] <techalchemy> commented on the existing issue

[23:09:42] <techalchemy> also i already released the two libraries in question

[23:13:15] <sumanah> sentences can be hard!

[23:16:38] <sumanah> ok, I need to go do other stuff, but good luck techalchemy

[23:16:45] <sumanah> take breaks, drink water, eat food, etc

[23:16:51] <techalchemy> thanks sumanah!